Igniting Potential: John J.R. Rennie's Mission to Help Others Discover Their Purpose

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Welcome to the Living the Dream podcast with Curveball. If you believe, you can achieve.

SPEAKER_00 0:14

Welcome to the Living the Dream with Curveball Podcast. A show where I interview guests that teach, motivate, and inspire. Today's guest is John J.R. Rennie. He is a successful entrepreneur who spent nearly four decades building a successful business software company until his life experienced an unexpected change. What he thought would be his retirement, it led to a calling for him to launch Brush Fires Ministry, an organization dedicated to helping believers discover their God-given destiny and purpose. And John has, you know, leadership and team building experience. So we're going to be talking to John about Brush Fires Ministry and about all the things that they're up to and gonna be up to. So John J. Al Rennie, welcome to the show.

SPEAKER_02 1:15

Well, thank you, Chris, for having me. I look forward to chatting with you and and uh hopefully this will be beneficial to your audience.

SPEAKER_00 1:25

Why don't you start off by telling everybody a little bit about yourself?

SPEAKER_02 1:29

Well, you said a lot of it in the uh intro. Uh 2016 was a significant year of my life where God redirected me from the corporate world uh into starting a ministry. Uh it was never anything that I had intended to do, wanted to do, uh, and it has been quite a ride. But the the end result is I get to help other people experience that same sort of relationship and transition in their lives that God led me through. So what He showed me in 2016 and every year since then about doing what it is that God's created you to do is now my pleasure to be able to help others discover that for themselves. So it's been a real blessing in my life.

SPEAKER_00 2:29

Yeah. So after spending nearly four decades building a successful business software company, talk about what actually did happen in 2015 when God uh gave you this calling.

SPEAKER_02 2:44

Well, what happened was, first of all, uh we experienced our largest loss ever. At that point, the company was about 30 years old. We had never had a loss period of any significance, and certainly nothing like that size. And going into January 2016, I knew that I had one of two choices. It was either to take whatever money is left in the company and close it, or it is to cut all expenses and try to keep the company open for my employees and my clients throughout North America. But the only way that I could make them the numbers work was for me to stop taking a paycheck. So starting in January 2016, I still have a software company, but I stopped taking a paycheck, even though I was still working full-time for it, so that my employees could get paid and so that my clients could uh get the services that they needed to stay in business. I then try to find a way of replacing that income. Um, but unlike any other time in my life, everything I went into, there was no opportunity, there was no doors opened. It just was God was not uh cooperating. And in May of 2016, very frustrated, very angry at God for messing up my plans, I said, I know you're behind this. What do you want? And I didn't hear anything from God at that moment, but I suspect it was something like, Oh, good, I'm glad I've got your attention. Now wait. And I did, uh, again, trying to draw closer to God, trying to figure out what it is that he was trying to do. And in September, October of that year, an acquaintance came up to me and said, Hey, I teach people how to analyze and to understand the psychometric assessment results. I think you'd be great at it. And what he was really saying is, I charge a lot of money for people to go through this training, and I want you to pay me uh to do it. Well, after nine to ten months of not going and not having a paycheck, you're pretty uh select as to how you're spending your money. And I was not about to spend four digits on him teaching me something that I had no desire to do, no intention, and didn't even know what psychometric assessments were. And I left that meeting, told him no, flat out no, and went home. And the Holy Spirit said, do it. I was like, This makes no sense. Why am I doing this? Do it. I don't even know what psychometric assessments are, God. Why do I want to do this? Do it. Called up the guy the next day, renegotiated the price, had my wife and I sign up, and after a couple weeks, I realized that it's something that was not only interesting to me, but was something that was a natural thing for me to learn. Uh it was like I was it was a language that I never knew before that I um understood completely. So what I did was uh I continued with that course for nearly a year, and I went about um expanding upon that, listening to God, and in May of 2017, uh contemplating my purpose statement, God made it clear that He wanted me to write the curriculum to bring this to the church. And once I said yes to him, he gave me the name of the ministry, Brush Fires Ministry. And I've been working full-time in this ministry, getting discipleship and helping people discover their God-given purpose now, ever since then.

SPEAKER_00 6:49

Well, what was the biggest challenge when you were transitioning from business owner to ministry founder?

SPEAKER_02 6:56

Uh, loss of identity was part of it because I saw myself as the successful business owner, and I I was. Uh, but that's not my identity. My identity is a son of the most high God. Uh, the other one was getting the church to embrace it. Um, discipleship is not going on in this in this in the American church. Uh, people go to church, they get a latte, they sit down, they watch a rock concert with smoke machines and uh lasers. Uh, extremely well done. They get a TED talk and then they go home. It's not that's not discipleship. Okay, that is entertainment. The American people have become consumers, and so they're not producing disciples. Uh, we are having people do altar calls, but we have no idea if they really did accept the Lord. We have no mentoring, no follow-up, and so people have this false understanding that they're saved, and they may be, but there's no evidence of it because there's no discipleship and no follow-up going on. So there's been all kinds of challenges because these are things that the church doesn't want to address, doesn't want to talk about. It's too messy to deal with people's lives, and so they just don't do it. So getting this whole thing accepted and embraced by the church uh has been one of the biggest challenges. So to put it in a simple phrase, God's people have been the biggest child, or God's leaders.

SPEAKER_00 8:39

Well, you talk about helping believers discover their God-given purpose and destiny. Why do you feel so many Christians struggle with that question?

SPEAKER_02 8:48

Because they don't see demonstrated in front of them. Uh they will see people on stage, and uh, based upon their understanding of who they are, their training, their experience, they go, Well, that's the paid professional um ministers, so it's their job to minister. My identity is a mother, a husband, a business owner, a construction worker. I'm not them. That's not my job. And so they don't see that ministry is necessary, they don't see normal, everyday people uh demonstrating the fruit of the spirit. So there's no um example for them to follow. Uh, they dismiss the ones that they see on stage because, well, I will never be a missionary, or I'm never going to be a worship leader, or I'm never going to be a senior pastor. And they completely dismiss that the that they have a ministry and that God wants to work with them as they are, uh, and cause them to become the the warriors for Christ that He's created them to be.

SPEAKER_00 10:05

How has your experience in building high performance teams and business affected the way that you approach ministry and personal development?

SPEAKER_02 10:15

So, what I've learned is that you need to go to the people that are hurting the most. Uh, and so there are a lot of people within the church that are really searching. They know that there's more out there, they just don't know where to look and how to find it. And so we've worked with them first, and that's how we established our design workshop uh by going directly to where the need is, which is the lay people in the church. And as they start to see themselves as God created them, go back to Samuel when Samuel was sent to the sons of Jesse, and he's looking at all these big strapping sons, going, Oh, surely that's the next king of Israel. And God rebukes them. He says, Stop that. You're you're you're looking at the outside. I don't look at that, I look at their heart. So Samuel did not rest until he saw all the sons, even the son that Jesse didn't even want to show him, who he left out in the fields. Until that son showed up, Samuel wasn't done with his searching for the next king. And David was described as a man after God's own heart. The desires of David's heart are the same as the desires of God's heart. Or more accurately to say, David aligned his desires with the same desires that God has. To love God and to love your neighbor. Every human being, saved or unsaved, was sent to earth for a purpose. First and foremost, to love God, second of all, to love their neighbor. Now, you can simply look at the news on a daily basis, and you can see how good of a job we're doing that um throughout the world. Um we're obviously failing, but you can't really love God until you've accepted Christ, because it's that relationship that Christ paid for, and that um payment of uh of our sin debt that allows us to come into the presence of the Father, that allows us to be able to experience that, and it also allows us to be able to be um empowered by the Holy Spirit to be able to achieve God's work here on earth, and every believer has that access to the Father, but they're not going to the Father saying, like David, what do you want me to do, Dad? What am I supposed to do? Well, first and for foremost, love me and then love your neighbor. Well, how do I do that? Well, I gave you the gift of communication, so I want you to be an evangelist, I want you to be a pastor, I want you to be um an encourager, I gave you the gift of leadership, I want you to build ministries, I want you to uh come alongside the church leadership and help them, help them to grow. I gave you the gift of counseling, I want you to help the people that are hurting, that have been traumatized in this world. I gave you the the gifts of service and works. I want you to come alongside and encourage people by showing up and being there for them. However, God's gifted you, which is what our design workshop reveals, that's how you are to love your neighbor. So you can love your neighbor by teaching them, if that's the gift that God's given you. You can love your neighbor by uh being an evangelist and leading them to Christ. Whatever is the giftings that God's given you, that's how you demonstrate your love uh for your neighbor, and thereby your love for God by being obedient to what He sent you to earth to do.

SPEAKER_00 14:07

Well, talk about the system that you develop to help people evaluate their strengths and weaknesses and what is the most common thing people discover when they go through the process.

SPEAKER_02 14:20

Well, that they are different, they are unique, that they are someone that is um wired differently, they think differently, they have different gifts. So, one of the first things that people realize is something that they've done all their lives, which is project how they are wired onto other people, is incorrect. They find out that what um is easy for them may not be easy for somebody else, and what's hard for them might be easy for somebody else. And the way that they see and react to the world is different than how other people see and react to the world, and that's okay because God designed them uniquely to be able to accomplish the work that He's created them to do. So, one of the very first things they do is they find out how accurate our assessments are, and then especially if they wind up doing this with a loved one, a wife, a husband, you know, a friend, they get to see the uniqueness of how their friend is created. It think of it as a series of puzzle pieces. Uh, and the puzzle isn't completed until all the pieces have found the right place. Well, that's the way the body of Christ is. The body of Christ is not functioning until every member of the body of Christ has figured out what it is that they're supposed to be doing and begins to intentionally perform those those tasks, those parts of the body that are that they were designed to perform. So they start to see the big picture of God's plan for the church, God's unique plan for their lives, and how they can actually make a difference simply by being obedient to what God created them to do.

SPEAKER_00 17:28

Can you share a powerful transformation story uh from someone who discovered their purpose through Brushfire's ministry?

SPEAKER_02 17:36

Oh, yeah, there's there's so many. Uh this is one of my favorite ones. So the very first workshop I did was in February 2018, and nobody knew anything about the ministry. I mean, uh we were very, very basic, uh dry race board and uh handwritten notes. And we had about seven people sign up for the program, and one of those people was a lady named Izzy. So they show up and we're going through the curriculum that I wrote, uh, and we get through the identity class and purpose class, and somewhere after the service uh and um praise and worship class, all of a sudden Izzy's gone. And I text her, call her, doesn't respond at all, completely ghosts me. And I think, well, I guess she didn't like it, or who knows what. I can't get a word back from her, so I just forget about it. Continue to do the class. That class told other people, so the next class was double the size. And a year later, we had 20, 30 people in a class, uh, and we were doing the the workshop three times a year. And a year later, in walks Izzy with her husband, and I I go, Okay, hey, Izzy. Uh, nice to see you again. Uh what happened? And she goes, Well, JR, uh, I took your assessments and I disagreed with them. I go, that's not me. Izzy at the time was the uh president of a commercial roofing company. So she was used to dealing with construction workers, and as she put it, I was large and in charge. But she kept on seeing us promoting the next workshop one after the other, and something about the Holy Spirit wouldn't let her rest on it. So she took her assessment results that she did back in February 2018 to her husband, and he says, Man, this brush fires class is just not right. You know, look at these results. I this is not who I am. And her husband, uh, Peter looks at those results and goes, That's who you are? That's who you are, that's who you are. These are completely accurate about who you are. And she just, really? Anyway, so Izzy and her husband, Peter, go through the program, uh gets their purpose statement, and Izzy decides that the assessments and the calling on her life was right, and is the first thing she does is all right, I'm I'm gonna quit this, you know, president's job of this commercial uh um roofing company. She goes off and gets a uh she had a beautician's um certificate, but she felt a call to work with women that had gone through cancer uh and breast reconstruction mastectomies. And she got a license in doing cosmetic tattooing. Um, when a woman goes through a mastectomy, they just basically lop everything off. And you know, surgeries later, there's a form of a breast there, but it doesn't look real, it doesn't look right. But but Izzy, through her skill um and learning, um helps them look more like a woman afterwards with her tattooing. And while they are in her chair, she is praying over them for healing, she is talking to them, she is witnessing them. She is more alive at that point as she is witnessing to the woman that she's ministering to than at any other point in her um being a president of a commercial uh roofing company. So when Izzy goes into one of our workshops and introduces herself, this is how she starts. Hi, my name is Izzy. I'm a brush fires dropout. And then she starts to share the story of how it the program transformed her life, and it's a beautiful, it's a beautiful thing that God did.

SPEAKER_00 21:48

Absolutely. Well, what do you feel churches and ministry leaders can do better to help people discover their unique gifts and calling?

SPEAKER_02 21:58

Uh well, I mean, there's other programs out there, but ours, I obviously I think is unique and best. So they can contact us, we'll tell them about what it is and how we approach it. The difference between our discipleship program and others is that we have a destination for the individual, it's their purpose. So when a when an individual discovers what their God-given purpose is, they frequently need a mature believer to guide them through that transition. They may not have the biblical foundation, maybe they didn't have the right teaching from the from the churches that they were attending in the past that they understand the core truths of their faith. Maybe they haven't established the spiritual disciplines about prayer and reading scripture and quiet time and humility and submission. Uh, and so therefore, they don't have a real relationship with God other than the superficial. Maybe they've got some personal disciplines, maybe there's unforgiveness in their heart, or they're they're a slave to money and they're not, you know, giving uh correctly to the church. There's a there's a series of things that will get into a person's way uh of being able to walk out their purpose, so they need a mature. Believer that is further down the sanctification path than they are to help them examine themselves and then hold them accountable to grow in those areas that that they are deficient in. So if you don't really understand that you're saved by grace and not by works, you need to understand that. Because the concept of me having to work for my salvation puts you in a very vulnerable place of always wondering if you're saved. God doesn't want that for his children. Christ paid for it once. You want to know that you're saved? Examine to see if you're demonstrating the fruit of the spirit. Are you more loving than you were before you were saved? Do you have more peace, more joy? Are you kinder, gentler, faithful? Do you have more self-control, patience? Examine those things. And if you can start to see evidence of the fruit of the spirit in your life, okay, you're saved. It's done. Don't worry about it. Now let's get on with the work that you were created to do. And that's where the leaders and the elders can start to help them grow into whatever ministry that is that God wants to uh accomplish through their obedience. So that's what our program does is we show you what the destination is. This is what this individual was designed to do. Church leaders help them achieve it. Open the doors, train them, encourage them, help them align them with another believer that has that has established a ministry, if that's the calling, or who's a good teacher, or who's a counselor. Connect them so that that person can apprentice them, like the old, you know, if you didn't just become a carpenter in the old days or a blacksmith, you worked side by side, a mature carpenter or blacksmith, and you watched as they did the work so that you could actually do the work yourself. And that's the model for discipleship. Be connected to somebody that can show you how to do what it is that God created you to do.

SPEAKER_00 25:38

Well, for someone listening right now who might feel stuck, frustrated, or unsure about God's plan in their life, what is the first practical step you recommend they take this week?

SPEAKER_02 25:50

Well, we have a website. Uh, this is all available throughout all of North America. So you can go to brushfireslash digital.com. It's completely free to register there. And if you take the time to register, we'll give you four books as well as one of the 11 assessments that are part of our design workshop. You'll get the Romans 12 Spiritual Gifts Assessment all free simply by registering. Uh, once you've evaluated our system, you can sign up online. You'll get your videos, you'll get the uh assessments, and you'll be on track to get a purpose statement to understand what all these assessment results mean. You'll get a book, you'll have all the resources available to you to be able to start the process of discovering what that purpose is. The final step uh of our first workshop is the of the design workshop is to go through a three-hour coaching session where a trained um analyst, assessment analyst will tell you and show you based upon your assessment results, the unique parts of who you are, the areas that the enemy is going to exploit to try to discourage you from walking into God's purposes, uh, the areas of conflict that he will use because your design uh conflicts with somebody else's design. The enemy is an expert. He's got a PhD in human design. He's been looking at us for a millennium, and he hates every one of God's children, saved or unsaved, he hates us. Why? Because we have the capacity to have a relationship with the Father that he is no longer able to have. So he hates every one of us and he wants to destroy us. We need to understand the easiest way for him to destroy us, which is typically connected to our design. I'll give you an example. There are people that don't like making mistakes, okay? Uh they they have a sense of accuracy and perfection that dominates how they are. Okay, and that's that's not a bad thing, it's a good thing. And when so when they do something uh and they've invested it and they put it out there, and a month later somebody says, Well, you know, this is wrong, and or the grammar is incorrect, or your your references are wrong, or whatever, they get really upset. Not so much that somebody pointed out a mistake, but somehow they weren't perfect and accurate enough to get it right the first time. I don't have that problem. So in that particular situation, that person, somebody comes up with, hey, you did this wrong, and they get really uh frustrated and maybe don't want to try next time because I I I always mess up type of mentality. With me, I say, Oh, thanks. Cut paste, make the fix, done, and I move on. So the enemy knows how to attack that sort of person, and he has a unique way of attacking me based upon my design. So we warn people through this coaching session of all the different ways that the enemy is going to try to hurt you. A lot of church hurt is connected to this, a lot of relational hurt, divorce, separation are connected to these things. And we help you to see yourself clearly so that when somebody triggers something in you that the enemy has placed, you don't react, you respond in grace and love, and you learn from it, as opposed to I'm never gonna go to that church again because they said this about me, you know, that sort of thing.

SPEAKER_00 29:44

Well, what else is Bushfire's ministry working on that people need to be aware of?

SPEAKER_02 29:50

So, uh, what we found out is after doing these assessments for a very long time, uh, there's people like Izzy out there uh that are entrepreneurial types that are self-starters. But most of the people out there that go through our program, they would complete the program, get their purpose statement. Their husband or wife would agree with the purpose statement, they would agree with it. Uh obviously, we agreed with it. Uh, they would they were instructed to take it to God and we would follow up with them to see if God confirmed it and they'd get that confirmation. But then we sent them back to their churches and nobody discipled them. The Bible refers to us as sheep. That's not a compliment. Sheep are really pretty thick-headed and and do things that aren't necessarily healthy for them. Most of the people that we run into need a shepherd, and that's where our discipleship framework comes up. That's the program that I'm working on now. Um I'm just about to release the first book of that series, uh, Why Discipleship Isn't Working. The second book is about 60%. Um collaborating with my own church. Uh I'm not a pastor, but the church that my wife and I attend. And uh they are very interested in implementing this. This discipleship framework, it's not a program, it's not formulaic, but it brings up all the different elements necessary for a person to be able to walk out their purpose. The disciplines that they have to have in place, the core truths of scripture that they have to have firmly implanted in them, the personal disciplines, the relationship with the Father, um, the training up of mentors, you know, to get people qualified to be able to be that mentor um for the disciple, uh, the different internal battles, strongholds, if you will, that disciples have that they have to contend with to be able to uh walk out that purpose. I mean, God has used the last 10 years of my life to painstakingly learn these lessons uh as I've had to struggle with them. And now I've got the pre privilege of putting them into training so that other people can say, All right, this is where your struggle is. You need to work on this, you need to ask God for wisdom, you need to uh take this training, you need to forgive this person, you need to um walk away from that temptation, you need to rebuke that sin in your life, whatever it happens to be. This training, this framework identifies all those missing pieces so that a mentor can say, All right, you're good in all these other areas, but this is what's holding you back. Let's focus in on this, let's engage the father for wisdom and insight to be able to address that. And that's what this program is is intended to do, the framework. Uh, in addition to the two-book curriculum, there will be about a half a dozen assessments that will be connected to a mentor so that the mentor can see exactly what the struggles are in the person's life. These are all brand new assessments, they're not, they're different than the psychometric assessments that uh we have for the uh for the design workshop. And that will be ultimately released as the final product, probably for general release uh beginning of next year. Um, I will be hopefully implementing it uh at our church uh this year. Uh I in fact um the leadership team of our church is gonna start going through the first book probably within the next 45 days.

SPEAKER_00 33:53

Okay, well, the website is brushfire stash digital.com. Guys need to definitely check that website out. Close us out with some final thoughts, maybe if that was something I forgot to touch on that you would like to talk about, or any final thoughts you have for the listeners.

SPEAKER_02 34:08

Yeah, I what the vast majority of people have settled for in their Christian faith is so short of what God wants for them. It would be like a person that has never had beef before and tastes a McDonald's hamburger and goes, Wow, this is really good. And then I come along on saying, Oh, you like that? Well, here's a brisket that's been cooked 18 hours. You should really try that. No, no, no, I'm I'm happy with my McDonald's hamburger. You but you've never tried brisket. You should really give it a go because if you like the McDonald's hamburger, you're going to love this brisket. It is so amazing. No, no, no. I'm good with I'm good with my, you know, show up to uh to uh church on Sunday, give my nod to God, uh, and and go home. I will tell you that the things that God has accomplished through my life, the changes that he has done to my personality, the witnesses of other people go, man, JR, you have really changed for the good. Here's a thought to leave your um listeners with. When I ask leaders in the church if the Galatians 5, 22 through 23, fruit of the spirit, are they a human want or are they a human need? Think about it. Is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, gentleness, faithfulness, and self-control. Is that a human want or is it a human need? If you really, really think about it, and this is where most of these leaders come to, it's a human need. The fruit of the spirit is the uh nutritional healing fruit that uh every human being needs to heal their soul. That trauma, those lies, the PTSD, the addiction. The fruit of the spirit is the healing south for your soul. You can't buy love, you can't buy kindness, you can't buy gentleness or faithfulness or self-control. It is a gift of the Holy Spirit as you are obedient to the work that God does in your life. So, you want to change your life, you want to actually live a life that of meaning in of faith, figure out what God wants you to do, do it with in faith, pursue Him for His guidance and His leadership, and allow the Holy Spirit to produce that faith and that that fruit through your obedience as you share that fruit with the people that you're ministering to, you are the faithful farmer who gets to partake in that fruit first and foremost. I'll leave you with one story. Last year I was asked to speak at a conference, and after figuring out what this particular Christian group needed, I had these materials uh in speaking notes, but I wanted to get a book to them. So I worked really, really hard to get this book out. Literally got it in the hands of one of the leaders before they took off for the conference. Went there, gave the message, and it was all well received. And I thought, cool, I did what I needed to do. I woke up the next morning and I had this sense of peace about me. I would I wasn't scheduled to speak again that day, so I just went about my normal routines and left uh to go back home in my car, listening to worship music, which I do all the time. But the sense of peace is growing and growing and growing. I stop off at this restaurant for breakfast. Uh I asked to be seated outside, it was a nice day, and they forgot I was out there. After about 20 so minutes, the waitress comes out there completely expecting me to be angry at her. And my only concern was hey, I don't want you to be upset. I don't want you to be worried about this. It's all good. It's all good. It's you know, I'm happy here. Get my breakfast, um, leave a tip, walk out the door, and all of a sudden the Holy Spirit showed me this is the best version of you, JR. The one that's not rushed, the one that is at peace, the one that uh uh uh gives compassion to a worried waitress, the one that is generous, this is the best version of you. Prior to that morning, my understanding of peace was the absence of conflict. If I just don't have a problem that I'm dealing with for the next hour, that is peace. No, that wasn't peace. What I experienced that morning as a fruit of the spirit, that was peace. Our understanding of love, joy, and peace is it so off the mark because we have never experienced it before. We don't know what the fruit of the spirit really is. If we did know what it was, we would desire it with all our heart and we would pursue it with all our might. I gotta tell you, I now know what peace, the beginning of peace, looks like, and I want more of it.

SPEAKER_00 40:04

All right, as we all do. So to keep up with everything that JR is up to, visit brushfires-digital.com, check out the books, you know. Uh follow rate review, share this episode to as many people as possible, especially those who are looking for true peace. And also visit www.curveball337.com to keep up with all things living the dream. Thank you for listening and supporting the show. And JR, thank you for all that you do to help uh believers find their purpose and uh destiny, their God-given purpose and destiny, and thank you for joining me.

SPEAKER_02 40:46

Oh, it's been my pleasure, Curtis. Thank you for the opportunity.

SPEAKER_01 40:50

For more information on the Living the Dream with Curveball podcast, visit www.curveball337.com. Until next time, keep living the dream.